Transcendancing ([info]mynxii) wrote,
@ 2008-01-14 15:13:00
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Entry tags:community, fandom, faq, swancon

Swancon FAQ - Time to refresh
Hi all, last year I did an FAQ for Swancon, it was well received and I wish to have it available again for people to take advantage of.

To that end, I wanted to give people the opportunity to review it and read over it, offer suggestions and additional information that they'd like to see in there, also feel free to point out any typos etc that may still exist in there.

This may be redundant, but there's a -LOT- of information below the cut, so only click if you dare :)



SWANCON

INTRODUCTION
Swancon is the primary social event for Western Australia's science fiction and fantasy fan community. All hobbies tend to develop closely knit and strong communities and subcultures, and the local science fiction scene is certainly no different.

As is the case with subcultures, a lot of acronyms, abbreviations and jargon tends to get thrown around and used. An unfortunate side-effect of all this jargon is that conversing with some fans can seem quite intimidating because of all the strange words and terms used. If you're ever confused, simply ask the person you're talking to what they mean.

To help you out, we have compiled some of the more common fan-related terms and words that we have encountered over the years. Some of the following terms may already be familiar to you, or even blindingly obvious - some of them may not. Either way, we hope it is helpful.

ABOUT CONVENTIONS IN GENERAL

What is a convention?

A convention is an assembly of people meeting for a common purpose. It is partly a conference, and partly a festival. Often there are guests invited, these can be international, national or local.

There is a program of events set out, but this is largely a framework to hang a larger experience on. Many of the programmed items have a formal feel about them, like the Guest of Honour Speech, and others are obviously meant to be entertaining and fun.

Unlike a conference, a convention runs outside of business hours, often having social events programmed into the evening. These social events are considered just as much an important part of the convention experience. Some attendees prefer the social side of a convention to the officially programmed side.

What can I expect to happen at a convention?

Expect the unexpected! A convention is a chance for people who don't usually see each other to get together and socialise - probably while sharpening up their debating skills around a bar. A convention can be as structured or as free-form as you like. Some features:
• Sellers of SF-F related merchandise (otherwise known as Hucksters)
• Guests (these can be writers, artists, notable fans amongst others)
• Parties
• Conversations and discussions
• Gaming (board games, role-playing games, live action role play etc.)
• Masquerade Ball

What about Registration?
On the first day you should register as a con member and collect your badge and con bag. You'll need to wear this tag to get into all the programmed events.
The ‘con bag’ usually holds promotional material, a convention book and a "what's on at the con" programme listing. The convention book has articles on the guests and other subjects relevant to the con. You may even find some freebies in the con bag. The bag also often contains advertising material ranging from sponsors to special offers.
There is often a whiteboard or noticeboard near the registration desk. It's regularly updated with last minute changes and announcements, messages and lists of room parties that are the satellite events of the convention.
Can I go up to the guests and speak to them?

Most guests are very approachable and enjoy chatting to people during the event. Be respectful but try not to freeze, and remember that guests are people too and need some space. Also consider that there are a lot of people also hoping to get the chance to speak to the guests.

Can I ask for them to sign my book/tshirt?

In general you should take advantage of scheduled signing times to get your book signed. However this can be flexible depending on the guests. Use your discretion and remember that the guests are people too and need some space.

What should I bring if I'm just coming for the day?

Obviously this varies person to person, however a suggested list includes:
• A water bottle
• A notepad and pen
• Any books etc you would like to get signed
• Cash (For the buying from sellers, food or the auction)
• Your badge (which will be supplied upon arrival and registration)

What should I bring if I'm staying for the entire weekend?

Obviously this varies person to person, however a suggested list includes:
• Enough clothes for the weekend
• Your personal toiletries
• Cash (For the buying from sellers, food or the auction)
• Any food you don’t plan on buying during the convention (snacks for parties, breakfast etc)
• Any books etc you would like to get signed
• A note pad and pen
• A water bottle
• Your badge (once you register)



Who can I go to for help/advice/further questions, or if I have a major problem?

The convention committee will be available throughout the convention. Most conventions will introduce their committee at the Opening Ceremony; they may also identify those acting in a security capacity.

If you’re unsure, someone at the registration desk should be able to assist you or may redirect you to another committee member, depending on the problem. The committee will also be noticeable by their badges, which will be different from the other members in some way.

Hotels are largely unused to catering for an event like a convention, it taxes their space and resources considerably, so please be polite when dealing with hotel staff. It should be noted that while the convention committee has a contractual relationship with the hotel, they may not be able to overrule hotel policy.

ABOUT SWANCON ITSELF

What is Swancon?

Swancon is an annual convention in Perth. It focuses on science fiction, fantasy and horror within a variety of media and includes panels, discussions, workshops and presentations. There is also an opportunity to join in group meals, take part in competitions and go to room parties.

History of Swancon

The first Swancon was held in the home of local science fiction fan Anthony Peacey in 1976. A Swancon has been held annually in Perth ever since. The convention grew fairly rapidly in the early years, from being held in people’s homes to requiring the use of hotel function centres.

Swancon is the longest-running sci-fi convention in the Southern Hemisphere, having had no break in the annual tradition since its conception.

Do I need to wear a badge at all times?

Yes. Swancon is only open to people who have paid to attend, and the only way we have of telling if you are one of those people is by seeing you wearing your badge. You will need to wear it to all official Swancon events, including panels, the Masquerade, etc.

In other areas of the hotel you do not need to wear your badge, but it may be a good idea so that you can be identified as a Swancon attendee by others going to the convention. Also you can use it as a means of introduction and getting to know people, badges are not an uncommon talking point.

Is Swancon run at the same time every year?

Swancon is often run over the Easter weekend, however it can be run at any time of the year. This is up to each individual committee to decide.


Where is Swancon held?

Swancon is often held at a hotel, usually in Perth’s CBD, however this is not always the case. The choice of hotel changes every year depending on committee requirements and cost.

Can I bring my children?

Children are welcome to attend most (though not necessarily all) events of the convention, but only accompanied by a parent/guardian. Swancon does not provide child minding and takes no responsibility for the safety of your children. Swancon is a family friendly event, and items on the program that are unsuitable for children will be marked, however your discretion is advised. Swancon is also a public space and not all convention attendees are comfortable with children, keeping your children under your supervision is just as important as in any other large public event.

Do I have to go to the Opening Ceremony?

No, you don’t have to go to the Opening Ceremony. It is considered a nice way to start off the weekend and gives you the opportunity to be introduced to the guests and the convention committee (so you know who to look for if need be).

Do I have to go to the Closing Ceremony?

No, you don’t need to go to the Closing Ceremony. It’s a fantastic way to end the weekend, plus it it’s an opportunity to thank people for all the hard work they’ve put in getting the event to happen, and an opportunity to farewell the guests.

Do I have to dress up to go to the masquerade?

Some people often wear complicated and spectacular costumes that take huge amounts of effort to create and some people don't wear anything special. Most people make some effort, but it’s
entirely up to you.

Who is in charge? Who makes this whole thing happen?

This question has an answer in two parts. Firstly each Swancon is run by a team of volunteers or ‘con committee’. There is a different team each year and it takes two years from winning the bid to putting on the event. Each committee creates and organises their Swancon based on their vision, although they report to the organising body (WASFF). During the event you should speak to the con committee if you have any questions or concerns.

Secondly, like other community groups (sports clubs etc) we have an organisation in charge of the ongoing running of the business side of the convention. The organisation looking after Swancon is the WA Science Fiction Foundation (WASFF). The officers for this organisation are elected on an annual basis at the Annual General Meeting. This typically occurs on the Sunday of the convention, and all members of the convention are welcome to go to the meeting to participate and vote if they wish.




Tell me more about WASFF?

WASFF originally formed in 1993. It's birth was the result of concerns regarding the handover of funds from previous Swancons (SwanCon 14 - a NatCon - had left a substantial surplus) in a responsible and legal manner. There had also been concerns regarding the possibility of cons running at a loss and in the case of SwanCon 11, Grant Stone literally passing around the hat for donations to pay bill he personally was being pursued for as none of the creditors could contact the convenor/chair who had relocated to the Eastern States.

The initial committee: Greg Turkich (Chair), Ian Nichols (Vice-Chair), Tara Smith (Treasurer), Mark Bivens (Secretary/Administrator). Greg Turkich and Tara Smith were probably the most prominent of those calling for the formation of a body that could hold these funds on an ongoing basis.

WASFF's history since the initial formation has been an evolution from a fairly simple idea of a body that could act as the handover link for funds between one SwanCon and the next. From this beginning a series of developments led to WASFF managing the bidding process for SwanCons and voting for awards. These functions came from a perception of being even-handed and independent, as well as having a high level of continuity.

The membership of the WASFF board has been elected annually and has increased over the years with the addition of convention chairs becoming ex-officio members of the board as well as representatives form other cons/events as members or observers. There have been up to the present three Chairs – Greg Turkich, Luigi Cantoni and Rohan Wallace.

ALL ABOUT THE SOCIAL SIDE

How do I make friends around here?

Feel free to join in a conversation after a program item, or introduce yourself to someone who seems to share an interest. You can also visit public parties in the evening - this is often a great way to hang out and get to know people.

You could ask to join a group for dinner if you see them, or know some of those in the group (though politely accept it if turned down - it may be a prearranged group). Otherwise, you could throw yourself into activities during the convention, or share a drink in the bar.

Does everybody here know each other?

Not everybody knows everyone else. Many people attend Swancon every year, and have done so for a long time. Often people will know each other by sight and not necessarily by name, the convention is considered a great way of catching up with friends that you may only see once per year.

Where can I get reasonably priced food/drink?

Often the committee will have a list of local places that will be open and providing food and drinks, and usually this will be at the front desk. You could also ask a committee member, or join a group of people heading out together (it may be a closed group but most are open). Sometimes there may be discounts that have been arranged with local business, using your badge as a means of qualification for any special offers.

What is a room party?

A room party is a gathering of people in a hotel room during the convention. These vary from being small to large, they also vary on being open to all or being invite only. Generally if the door is ajar or open you’re welcome to join in. It’s not uncommon for these to go on well into the night, however it is common courtesy that the noise level will go down once it becomes late.

Room parties are considered an individual person’s responsibility, and are not the responsibility of the convention committee. All relevant laws about alcohol and drug use should be observed.

I keep hearing about cons within the con (Gynacon, for example). What are they and how do I get involved?
Sometimes there will be mini conventions running throughout the larger ones. These are informal and not usually run by anyone on the con committee. You can usually find out about them through conversation, announcements or fliers throughout the convention.

What is the ‘Dead Dog’ party?

The Dead Dog Party is organised on the last day of the convention. It is for all those not wanting the convention to end… just yet. Usually someone volunteers their house as a location, and this is announced at the closing ceremony. Often these are low key affairs where people hang out together and end the convention on a relaxed social note.


ALL ABOUT THE PROGRAM AND THINGS TO DO

What is a panel?

A panel is a group discussion led by two or three people (sometimes more, sometimes less) on a specific topic. A panel can also refer to a workshop, a presentation or a demonstration going on. These are all programmed items that you can attend if you are interested.

Panels are run usually by members of the convention who have volunteered or been asked to speak on a topic by the committee. In some cases outside experts are brought in from the local community in order to speak or present a topic.

Can I leave the room during a panel? What if I arrive late?

You are free to either leave the room during a panel, or come inside of you arrive late. It is considered polite to do so quietly without disturbing the discussion. Eg. Making sure the door doesn’t slam closed.

Does it matter that I don't understand what many of these panels are even about?

People attend Swancon for a variety of reasons, different people are interested in different things Swancon has to offer from writing, or art to gaming and panels.

There are usually a number of things going on at any given time, if none of them appeal, feel free to hang out in the fan lounge or the bar and chat to people, or chill out and read a book.

How do I find the panel room I’m looking for?

There should be a map of the convention space at the front desk. Usually it will also be in the program book. If all else fails, ask a committee member or even someone else passing by.

Conference rooms in hotels are usually named and committees almost always follow the hotel naming policy when designating rooms for panels and other activities.

What if there is nothing on the program I’m interested in at some point during the day?

There are a number of things to do at any time during the convention if you’re not interested in what is on the program. There is usually a media stream, showing anything from movies to the latest television shows. There is also usually a gaming room, the art show, and various other events. You can also hang around the fan lounge or have some quiet time and read a book.




GLOSSARY


OFFICIAL PROGRAM
This is the series of events put together by the committee. Usually there are multiple streams running simultaneously, so you always have a choice of something to do or see.

Program items include panels (see PANELS), presentations (given by one person on a topic), academic stream (where an academic/s present their research), Guest of Honour speeches, launches (such as for a new book or magazine), workshops (such as writing or costuming) and demonstrations (past years have featured weapon and costuming demonstrations).

The official program can be found in your con bag, and there are usually extra copies, information and updates at the registration desk.

MEDIA PROGRAM
This is a special sub-set of the program, which is usually a room set up to show media continuously throughout the program. The video stream often features fan favourites and new material not yet screened (or never to be screened!) here.

Please be courteous entering and leaving the video stream (light and noise from outside can be disruptive), and please note any ratings or warnings posted for particular video program elements where appropriate.

GUESTS
Are people the committee have invited to come and join in the convention for the purpose of entertainment as well as sharing of information and expertise. Different conventions have different patterns of international, national, and local guests. See below for more on guest etiquette, and common acronyms.

THE COMMITTEE
Organise and run the convention you are enjoying. They are identifiable by a different coloured badge and there will often be a committee member or volunteer behind the registration desk, which is staffed during the day.

During the Opening Ceremony of the convention, the committee should introduce themselves and point out where you can go for assistance and help at any time. The committee are there to help you enjoy your convention, so please don't hesitate to ask a question or for advice.

THE MEMBERS
If you have a membership pass (usually a piece of laminated cardboard on some string) you are a member. This grants you access to all convention events (program, video stream, masquerade, etc) and also let's you attend the WASFF AGM (see WASFF and AGM).

GAMING
There is a programmed gaming stream, and many people also bring their own games along. If you've never gamed before, there are also newbie/training sessions where experienced gamers talk you through the basics.
There are usually a range of different games played, including board games ranging from the specialist to the familiar, role playing games, and card games. You should feel free to start a game of your own.

MASQUERADE
The Masquerade is the 'ball' of Swancon. It usually has a theme, and members are encouraged (though not required) to dress in costume.

MARKET DAY
The market day is usually the busiest day of the Con where various traders (known generally as 'hucksters') take over the reception area and offer you a fine range of wares.

ART SHOW
The art show is open to submissions from any interested party for a small fee, that is determined by the organising committee. It runs for part of the time of the convention and there are awards given in the categories ‘Judges Choice’ and ‘Viewer’s Choice’. The judge is appointed by the organising committee.

PARTIES
There are official parties, usually they are launch parties for books, organisations, productions, conventions or publisher sponsored parties relating to a commemorative year, or a particular guest at the convention.

The most common type of party however, you won't find on the official program, but they are a feature of many conventions. These vary from being small to large, they also vary on being open to all or being invite only. Generally if there is a door ajar or open you’re welcome to join in. It’s not uncommon for these to go on well into the night, however it is expected that the noise level will go down once it becomes late.

Private room parties are considered an individual person’s responsibility, and not something that is the responsibility of the convention committee. All relevant laws about alcohol and drug use should be observed.

TIN DUCK
A Tin Duck is an award given out at Swancon each year for WA residents for achievements in a variety of mediums relating to science fiction, fantasy and horror.

The Tin Ducks were named following the creation of the Silver Swan Award, which was given to local fan Grant Stone for exceptional and continuing services to science fiction and fantasy in Western Australia. When creating a set of annual achievement awards that were not as prestigious-sounding as "Silver Swan", "Tin Duck" seemed humorously appropriate.

The Silver Swan has only been awarded twice in Western Australian fan history: to Grant Stone, and to the editors of local SF journal Eidolon in 2000.

MUMFAN
The Mumfan refers to the Marge Hughes award which is one of the two WASFF awards given out at the annual awards ceremony. The award is given in recognition for someone’s exceptional contribution to the WA fandom community. It represents the kind of work undertaken that is largely unseen, tireless and done without expectation of reward.

The following statement written about the mark that Marge Hughes made on WA fandom was written by Dave Luckett:

Of course it shouldn't come as a surprise to me that there are prominent and active fans around today who don't remember Marge Hughes, otherwise known as Mumfan. It was, as far as fannish history is concerned, long long ago now. She died, God, I suppose eighteen years ago now, when nearly everyone who's out con-running these days was still in short pants, or not
even alive. But it is a surprise, all the same. Mumfan was a one-off, a nonesuch, and I thought, (not examining the thought at all, or I'd have known it was ridiculous) that she'd never be forgotten.

She was Warren Hughes' mother, and even Warren isn't seen about much these days, though he does usually turn up to Swancon when he's in town.

But that isn't her claim to fame. Nor is it scholarship, or geekiness, or artistry, or brilliant wit, or being a great organiser. No, it was much more than that. It was goodness. It was warmth, and gentleness, and a sense of fun that never hurt, and acceptance, and laughter and wisdom that went far beyond mere cleverness. If you needed a shoulder to cry on, you went to Mumfan. If you needed someone to rejoice with, that was her. She never asked you why. She always knew, because she always noticed.

She went away and died, one day. She never said, never gave a hint. But when it happened, we all - every fan who knew her - felt a bleak loss of, I suppose, dimension. It was more than the void a good person leaves in the lives of those around her. Mumfan was what a lot of us aren't. There was a stillness about her, a depth, a stable core, a bone-deep integrity that she communicated to us. When she listened and accepted, she helped us explain ourselves to ourselves, helped us learn be satisfied with what we are, and to know it was right.

We felt, all of us then, that we couldn't just let that go. We had to remember it at Swancon. We thought we'd do something in her memory for the person who did the most, unrewarded and unnoticed, to make the con a success - that is, a joy, a wonder, an affirmation of who we are, in our
several and shambolic ways. We are fans. We are family, and she was mother to us all.

WASFF
WASFF is the acronym for the WA Science Fiction Foundation. WASFF is the organising body supporting each committee that runs Swancon. Each volunteer Swancon committee reports to WASFF who provide insurance, financial and legal backing to each Swancon.

Board members are elected to WASFF on an annual basis during the Annual General Meeting. This meeting typically takes place on the Sunday morning of Swancon and any member of Swancon is welcome to attend and vote.

Bids for the next Swancon (2 years ahead) are also decided at the AGM. Each proposed convenor will submit a bid form and verbally outline their Swancon proposition to the voting members attending the meeting. Voting is by the Optional Preferential system and all decisions made by WASFF are final.




PANELS
A panel is a group discussion led by two or three people (sometimes more, sometimes less) on a specific topic. A panel can also refer to a workshop, a presentation or a demonstration going on. These are all programmed items that you can attend if you are interested.

PANELLIST
Panellists are the people who have volunteered or been asked to speak on a topic by the committee. In some cases outside experts are brought in from the local community in order to speak or present a topic.

FANDOM
The term ‘fandom’ can reference any subculture group of people as fans of any particular common interest. More often it refers to the subculture of people interested in science fiction and fantasy. Both applications are characterised by their interest in even minor details of their fandom, and also spending a significant amount of time and energy following their interest.

FEN
A fairly old-fashioned plural form of “fan”. Instead of saying “fans”, one would say “fen”. To be honest this word is very rarely used, particularly among the younger generation of SF fans, but if you happen to hear it mentioned, this is what it is.

FANBASE
This term refers to the entirety of a group of fans interest in a particular area. The term extends from marketing lingo used to describe the popularity or saleability of a given item.

FANVID
An abbreviation of “fan video”. Fanvids are generally montage-based edited videos of clips from popular films, animations and television programs, set to music. Due to the rapidly expanding availability of both computer-based video editing and web distribution, fanvids have skyrocketed in scope and popularity. Many can be found on online video sharing services such as Youtube (www.youtube.com).
The purpose of the vid varies from telling a story based on the series or characters, suggestion and innuendo based on the interaction and chemistry between characters, highlights including comic elements that are particularly noteworthy.

FANTICIPOINTMENT
The continuing cycle of fans who will desperately await the release of something with the anticipation that it will rival the second coming of Jesus when it arrives, only to bag it relentlessly as soon as it arrives. Eg. ‘The Phantom Menace’.

FANZINE
An abbreviation of “fan magazine” and essentially an amateur magazine based around a particular fandom or hobby that was not produced for financial profit.

In the early days of international science fiction fandom (the 1930s to the 1970s), fanzines were a key method of debate and discussion among fans. Fanzines would be written containing reviews, essays, articles, short stories and the like, and be mailed to other fans around the country – or around the world.

The early fanzines allowed a sharing of ideas and critical debate long before the development of the Internet and the world-wide web. Since the popularisation of the Internet, the majority of paper-based fanzines have fallen by the wayside in favour of web-based fanzines, or “webzines”.

ANIME
Refers to ‘Japanese animation’. Unlike American animation, which is by-and-large perceived as “just for kids”, anime is enjoyed by all sectors of Japanese society. As a result, anime contains wonderful works of children’s and family animation, soap operas, comedies, action-adventures, thrillers, horror, sports and car racing dramas – even erotica.

Two of the best known anime series internationally are Osamu Tezuka’s “Tetsuwan Atom” and “Jungle Emperor Leo”, known internationally as “Astroboy” and “Kimba the White Lion”. It was Tezuka’s personal style (inspired by Walt Disney) – large eyes, childlike features, limited animation – that came to dominate the style of Japanese animation in general.

There is a local anime fan club, JAFWA (Japanese Animation Fans of Western Australia) that meets every Saturday night at Curtin University. Additionally, an annual anime convention is now staged in Perth every year called Waicon (http://www.wai-con.org/).

MANGA
The term “manga” is sometimes used to refer to Japanese animation – it actually refers to Japanese printed comics.
GRAPHIC NOVEL
Graphic Novels are a type of comic and are bound as a paperback or hardcover book, usually have a lengthy and complex storyline similar to those of novels, and are often aimed at mature audiences.

Graphic Novels can either be "Original graphic novels" (books first published as a paperback or hardcover book) or "Comic-book compilations" (books which were first published as a monthly comic and then collected and published as a single volume.)

Suggested examples: Alan Moore, Dave Gibbons, Eddie Campbell, Neil Gaiman

TELEFANTASY
Science fiction, fantasy and horror television dramas and comedies. The term is a fairly British one, and is often used to broadly describe genre works in that country. (i.e. BBC telefantasy would include Doctor Who, Red Dwarf, The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy and Blake's 7.)

SPECULATIVE FICTION
This term is used both as an umbrella term to cover science fiction, fantasy and horror, and as an alternative means of description used by those not wishing to be identified as a science fiction, fantasy or horror writer.

SCI-FI
Sci-fi, or science fiction refers to a broad genre that is based on or involves the use of current or theorised future science. Sci-fi is a theme associated with many mediums including books, magazines, movies, television and art.

Suggested examples: Greg Bear, Isaac Asimov, H.G. Wells,

FANTASY
Fantasy as a genre refers to fiction using magic and other supernatural or fantastical elements as the basis of plot, theme or setting. Fantasy generally sets out to make the impossible seem entirely probable or even, ordinary.

Suggested examples: David Eddings, Terry Goodkind, Terry Brooks, Raymond E. Feist, Guy Gavriel Kay Robin Hobb, James Barclay, George R. R. Martin, Krull, Conan the Barbarian

HARD SF
This type of science fiction is characterised by the focus on scientific or technical detail and the actual or probable theorised accuracy. It is rigorous in its application of scientific knowledge of the time, and where such knowledge is not invalidated by new scientific and technological discoveries.

Suggested examples: Greg Egan, Greg Bear, Alistair Reynolds

MILITARY SF
This sub-genre focuses on military cultures and fascism, and the plots tends to be about wars and battle tactics. It's primarily related to both Hard SF and Space Opera.

Suggested examples: David Drake, Joe Haldeman, Elizabeth Moon, Orson Scott Card, David Weber

APOCALYPTIC FICTION
This genre is often characterised as having elements from both science fiction and speculative fiction. It is specifically focused on the end of the world and civilisation through some natural or unnatural disaster.

Suggested examples: J. G. Ballard, John Wyndham, Stephen Kings’ ‘The Stand’, Larry Niven and Jerry Pournelle’s ‘Lucifer’s Hammer’, Akira

POST APOCALYPTIC FICTION
As the title suggests, this genre focuses on the direct aftermath of an apocalypse. The focus can vary from being set just after a disaster and the direct aftermath of those who have survived, or being set many years into the future and look at how the disaster changed society, highlighting elements of pre apocalyptic civilisation that have become mythologised or forgotten generations after the disaster.

Suggested examples: Marianne de Pierres, Sean Williams ‘The Change’ series, J. G. Ballard, John Wyndham, Stephen Kings’ ‘The Stand’, Larry Niven and Jerry Pournelle’s ‘Lucifer’s Hammer’, Margaret Atwood’s ‘Onyx & Crake” Mad Max, Waterworld, Akira

CYBERPUNK
This sub-genre of science fiction is characterised by its focus on technology and its effect on changing society. It features advanced science including cybernetic technology, artificial intelligence, as well as mega corporations and a daily life delivered by rapid technological exchange.

Suggested examples: William Gibson, Bruce Sterling, Neal Stephenson, The Matrix, Johnny Mnemonic, The Lawnmower Man, Ghost in the Shell

STEAMPUNK
Often set in or inspired by Victorian times, this sub-genre of science fiction focuses on the use of steam power in addition to other science fiction or fantasy elements. It is characterised to explore historical fictional technology, or the use of technology prior to its actual invention.

Suggested examples: China Mielville, William Gibson and Bruce Sterling’s ‘The Difference Engine’, Steamboy

SPACE OPERA
A hybrid form of science fiction and fantasy, which takes elements of sf (robots, lasers, spaceships) and uses them more as magic than true scientific thought experiment. lightsabres etc).

Suggested examples: Lois McMaster Bujold’s ‘Vorkosigan’ series, Iain Banks Star Wars, Flash Gordon, E. E. ‘Doc’ Smith’s ‘Skylark’ and ‘Lensman’ series, Blake’s 7, Battlestar Galactica

HORROR
Horror fiction has the intention, whatever it’s medium to scare, to horrify and to unsettle the audience. The cause of horror can range from the supernatural, either misunderstood or through the concept of evil. The genre is often characterised by being morbid, surreal and gruesome as well as liberally using suspense to frighten.

Suggested examples: Chelsea Quinn Yarbro, Poppy Z. Brite, Stephen King, Chuck Palahniuk, Nick Mamatas Resident Evil, The Saw, The Exorcist

VAMPIRE FICTION
The genre arose directly from Bram Stoker's novel Dracula, about a succubus-like creature which feeds on human blood. There's been speculation that Stoker was influenced both by regional myths and the real Marquis de Sade, amongst other things. The silent film Nosferatu was also hugely influential.

Suggested examples: Kim Harrison, Tanya Huff, L.A. Banks, Anne Rice ‘Vampire Novels’ and movies, Buffy the Vampire Slayer, Ultraviolet

URBAN FANTASY
Non-realist stories set in a more-or-less realist urban setting.

Suggested examples: Charles de Lint, Neil Gaiman’s ‘Neverwhere’, Justine Larbalestier’s “Magic or Madness”, Megan Lindholm’s ‘Wizard of the Pigeons’, Emma Bull’s ‘War for the Oaks’

DARK FANTASY

This genre is still relatively new in the sub-genre field. It combines elements of fantasy including use of the magic and the supernatural but with the added inclusion of elements of horror. Dark Fantasy also has a ‘grittier’ feel, it’s less clear cut who is ‘good’ and who is ‘bad’.

Suggested examples: Anne Bishop, Tanith Lee, Kim Newman’s ‘Night Mayor’, Ray Bradbury’s ‘Homecoming’, Kyla Ward’s ‘Kijin Tea’, Dan Simmons’ ‘Song of Kali’, Richard Matheson’s ‘I am Legend’, Margo Lanagan

HUMOROUS/SATIRE SCIENCE FICTION and FANTASY
There is a long tradition linking fantasy and satire, including such classics as Jonathan Swift's Gulliver's Travels and George Orwell's beast fable, Animal Farm. Often the imagined world acts as a mirror to real-world situations which the author critiques, while maintaining a deniable distance to real people and events.

Suggested examples: Douglas Adams’ ‘The Hitch-Hiker’s Guide to the Galaxy, Simon Haynes, Terry
Pratchett, Piers Anthony, William Goldman’s ‘The Princess Bride’, Jasper Fforde’s ‘The Eyre Affair’, Jonathan Swift’s ‘Gulliver’s Travels’, George Orwell’s ‘Animal Farm’.

ALTERNATIVE HISTORY/UNIVERSE
Stories in which history takes a different turn than that of reality, thus spawning a parallel timeline, or a very different universe. Usually these stories have points of commonality with the real world. A common example of this kind of "what if" is: What if Hitler had won WWII? But it can also be much more fundamental: What if magic existed instead of physics?

Suggested examples: Harry Turtledove, Kim Newman, John Birmingham, Eric Flint,

UTOPIA/DYSTOPIA
This genre arose from Sir Thomas Moore's famous thought experiment, Utopia, in which he attempted to create a perfect society. A dystopia is a critique of such a society, showing how seeming perfection often becomes distorted and turned into a hell on earth once human nature (ambition, greed, envy) or scarcities (of food, water, etc) are included in the mix.

Suggested examples: Utopian - Sir Thomas Moore’s ‘Utopia’, Dystopian - Anthony Burgess’ ‘A
Clockwork Orange’,

TECHNOTHRILLER
Near-future science fiction that isn't marketed as science fiction.

Suggested examples: Tom Clancy, Matthew Reilly, Michael Crichton.

YOUNG ADULT
Young Adult literature, works targeted at people aged 12 to 18 (although frequently enjoyed by people of all ages). YA, while not always Speculative Fiction, often has greater room for experimentation and blurring of genre boundaries than other types of literature.

Suggested examples: Scott Westerfeld’s ‘Uglies’, Garth Nix, Jane Yolen’s ‘Briar Rose’.

FILK
Put as simply as possible, “filk” is folk music with science fiction or fantasy-themed lyrics. It first developed as a feature of American science fiction conventions in the 1950’s but only really gained any popularity in the 1970’s. Filking has never been overly popular in WA fandom, but it has its proponents and does take place at some Swancons, this is an open activity and anyone is welcome to join in.

FURRIES
Furry fandom is a fan subculture based around an interest in anthropomorphic animals – that is, characters with humanoid bodies but animal heads and faces. Anthropomorphised animals have been a fixture of Western popular culture for decades: characters such as Mickey Mouse and Bugs Bunny are basically “furry” characters.

PHAT PHANTASY
This is a generally derisive term for large, multiple volume fantasy series, and trilogies that use clichéd and formulaic plot devices in their writing.

FAN FICTION
Fiction, written by fans, set in the world or continuing the narrative of an existing text (such as Lord of the Rings, or Xena).

SLASH FICTION
A subset of fanfiction which features a strong homoerotic plot or theme and refers to ‘slashing’ one character of a popular TV series, movie or book with another based on perceived subtext between the characters.

The genre's name was coined in the 1970s when early gay erotic fan fiction based on Star Trek was first being published. Writers would advertise what characters were being romantically or sexually paired together by writing "Kirk/Spock" or "Sulu/McCoy", et cetera, and so the term "slash" tended to stick for the genre as a whole.

CANON
Refers to the “official” texts of any given science fiction property, most commonly one from film or television. The term “canon” was original a Catholic one, used to refer to what religious texts were divinely inspired and therefore formed part of the New Testament and what texts did not.

It was then “borrowed” by fans of the fictional character Sherlock Holmes to distinguish between those stories and novels written by Arthur Conan Doyle and those subsequently written by other people. The first which were the “official” stories of what happened to the character and the latter describing stories which “never really happened” as far as the official story went.

FANON
A contraction of the term "fan canon". In some organised fandoms, certain fictional details are developed by fanfic writers that become popular enough that they are widely accepted as "part of the story". In some cases, "fanon" can become official parts of the authorised text.

This occurred several times during the course of the Star Trek franchise, where elements commonly used in fan fiction (such as Lt Sulu's given name being Hikaru) were ultimately taken up by actual films and episodes.

DITMAR
The Australian Science Fiction Achievement Awards, annual awards voted on by members of the Natcon, are known as the Ditmars, named after Melbourne fan Dick "Ditmar" Jensen.

NATCON
One science fiction convention held in Australia each year is designated the national convention, usually abbreviated to ‘Natcon’, and has the right to hand out the Ditmars. The Natcon has no fixed location, it is bid for by different states and the winner is determined at the Natcon AGM. Swancon has been the Natcon on many occasions.

AUREALIS AWARDS
The Aurealis Awards are awards for Australian SF, Fantasy and horror writing, sponsored by Aurealis Magazine (a publisher of Australian SF). They differ from the Ditmars because they are chosen by a small jury of professionals and critics.

CLARION
Clarion Science Fiction & Fantasy Writers' Workshop. Founded in 1968, this
intensive six-week workshop is currently held in San Diego; Seattle ("Clarion West"), and Brisbane ("Clarion South").

DUFF
DUFF stands for Down Under Fan Fund, a fan fund that sends fans from Australia to the USA or vice versa (alternately), generally sending a fan to either Worldcon (if it is in the US) or the Australian Natcon. The fan funds are entirely fan funded forms of cultural exchange.

GUFF
GUFF stands for Getting Up and Over Fan Fun, a fan fund that sends fans to the UK from Australia, or vice versa (in alternate years). Generally sends fans to the national convention of the other nation. The fan funds are entirely fan funded forms of cultural exchange.

GYNACON
Gynacon is a sister con that occurs at the fringes of Swancon, focusing on feminism in fandom, science fiction and fantasy. Gynacon was started by an small group of regular Swancon attendees that felt this was an area usually lacking in the main program as an attempt to address this imbalance. Gynacon events usually occur in hotel rooms of Gynacon supporters and are most often organised and advertised at the con itself. All feminist friendly members of Swancon are welcome to attend Gynacon panels/events. Event suggestions are also welcome.

FEMCON
Femcon is a women’s’ weekend retreat held annually, that aims to celebrate, inform and empower women, by creating a women’s only space, where children are welcome. Femcon was started by long time supporters of both Gynacon and Swancon. More information on Femcon can be found at http://community.livejournal.com/femcon/profile.
COMMON SWANCON ACRONYMS and ABBREVIATIONS

GOH - Guest of Honour
LGOH - Local Guest of Honour
FGOH - Fan Guest of Honour, an honour usually given to a fan in thanks for their
time, effort and contribution to the community.
ZINE - Short for ‘fan magazine’ and can be either printed or online.
WASFF - WA Science Fiction Foundation
AGM - Annual General Meeting
SMOF - Secret Master of Fandom, somewhat self mocking term used by those
behind the scenes organisers who make things happen, or at least think they do.
RPG - Role Playing Game
LARP - Live Action Role Play
CON - Convention
SCI-FI - Science Fiction, a term not greatly used due to negative association,
Sometimes pronounced ‘skiffy’
BNF - Big Name Fan, refers to fans that become very well known in their own
right.
D&D - Dungeons & Dragons, one of the first and most popular role playing games.
DANES - Mundanes, an elitist and outdated term referring to non-fans, rarely used
now and usually only by those complaining about its use.
JAFWA - Japanese Animation Fans of Western Australia
YA - Young Adult (referring to fiction)
DUFF - Down Under Fan Fund
GUFF - Get Up Over Fan Fund
Natcon - National Convention (Australia)
ASIM - Andromeda Spaceways Inflight Magazine, an Australian magazine of
pulp speculative fiction published every two months.
F&SF - Fantasy & Science Fiction magazine, founded in 1949. An American
magazine, F&SF was the original publisher of SF classics such as Daniel Keyes's Flowers for Algernon, and Walter M. Miller's A Canticle for Leibowitz.
ASif! - Australian Specific in Focus, a website with reviews of Australian
speculative fiction.
UNISFA - University of Western Australia Science Fiction Association
UCC - University Computer Club
MARS - Murdoch Alternative Reality Society
CIA - Curtin Imagination Association




(Post a new comment)


[info]editormum
2008-01-14 07:08 am UTC (link)
Girlie, that's HUGE. My only suggestion from a skim read is the first sentence:

"Swancon is the primary social event for Western Australia's science fiction and fantasy fan community."

Two things - is the phrase "speculative fiction" more encompassing and accurate than "science fiction and fantasy". Speculative fiction fan community include horror and all of the sub genres, rather than just F and SF.

Also, by saying that "Swancon is ... for Western Australia's..." you seem to indicate that it's ONLY West Aussies welcome or attending. Perhaps something like "Swancon is the primary social event operated by Western Australia's science fiction and fantasy fan community, and is open to all interested parties."

Just my thoughts :)

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[info]mynxii
2008-01-14 07:27 am UTC (link)
I'll play with it :)

It's meant to be an intro document so it may be better to add 'horror' to the list rather than relying simply on 'speculative fiction' as that is unlikely to mean much to a first time con goer.

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[info]mynxii
2008-01-14 07:32 am UTC (link)
how is this:

Swancon is the primary social event for Western Australia's science fiction, fantasy and horror fan community. All hobbies tend to develop closely knit and strong communities and subcultures, and the local science fiction scene is certainly no different. People come from all over the state, interstate and even internationally to attend the event.

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[info]editormum
2008-01-14 08:29 am UTC (link)
Lovely :) Someone who listens to me!

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[info]mynxii
2008-01-14 07:35 am UTC (link)
can you email me your email address please hon? transcendancing at gmail dot com.

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[info]threemonkeys
2008-01-14 07:29 am UTC (link)
Gosh, its grown since I last saw it. Do you mind if I forward it on to the NZ natcon committee - they may find it useful and I'm not volunteering to do a welcome talk this year. The NZ natcon is also at Easter which is why I won't be at Swancon - more's the pity.

One thing which I found struck home when doing this welcome stuff is an assurance to new folk that their expression of fan interest is just as valid as anybody elses. People come in with particular interests within the wider genre and they will worry that people are going to shun them because their tastes may be too juvenile or not sophisticated enough or some such rubbish. You just need to reassure them that all fannish interests are valid and welcome.

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[info]mynxii
2008-01-14 07:37 am UTC (link)
Send away :)

I have a more general version i did for convergence last year if you would like that? leave me your email address and I'll send it along :)

And yes - to everything you said in your second para :)

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[info]threemonkeys
2008-01-14 07:40 am UTC (link)
Yes please for the more general one - mittsusaru at gmail dot com

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[info]stephbg
2008-01-14 07:33 am UTC (link)
Thanks for putting this up. I'm very keen on soothing the fears of new members. So many fen (I still say it) know each other at least well enough to say hello that a newbie is more than likely to feel left out. I know there's almost always a "So this is your first convention?" panel, but the tone of these over the last couple of years has become increasingly "So here we are again". It's increasingly felt like a big let down after the excitement of the opening ceremony.

Sorry. Minor off-topic rant ends. Commentary on FAQ begins.

A couple of thoughts:

* What can I expect to happen at a convention?

You've mentioned these elsewhere but it wouldn't hurt to add them to the summary list:

* Art Show
* Award ceremonies
* Signings
* Book launches

* What is the "fan lounge"?
The fan lounge is an area set aside for members to relax and chat without disturbing scheduled panel items or events.

* What is the 5:2:1 law?
In every 24 hours each member should get at least 5 hours sleep, eat at least two meals and have at least one shower.

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[info]mynxii
2008-01-14 07:48 am UTC (link)
Summary list added.

Other 2 questions. Under 'About conventions in general':

What is the 5-2-1 rule I hear mentioned?

This refers to the rule of thumb that is recommended for all attending members of the convention and translates to the suggestion that people should get a minimum of 5 hours of sleep, 2 meals and 1 shower per day of the convention.

Under 'About the program and things to do':

What is the fan lounge?

The fan lounge is an area set aside for members to relax and chat without disturbing scheduled panel items or events. The area is usually close by to the registration desk.

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[info]utopos
2008-01-14 09:27 am UTC (link)
"Swancon is the primary social event for Western Australia's science fiction and fantasy fan community. All hobbies tend to develop closely knit and strong communities and subcultures, and the local science fiction scene is certainly no different."

Wai Con is bigger, and for many SF/F fans under 30 it's their primary fannish event. I suggest changing to "Swancon is WA's oldest and longest-running social event for the science fiction and fantasy fan community."

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[info]mynxii
2008-01-14 09:35 am UTC (link)
Wai Con is almost entirely Anime, and is not general sf, f and horror, at which point i'm still happy with the text.

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[info]utopos
2008-01-14 09:45 am UTC (link)
Premier then.
Primary evokes thought of schools or the existence of a secondary (at which point one wonders where the secondary con is).

Wai Con features almost entirely Fantasy + SF from the anime, video games and manga mediums, and has just as much a right to call itself an SF con as the first 15 years of Swancon (which had just as narrow a medium focus).

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[info]mynxii
2008-01-14 09:48 am UTC (link)
Premier works for me.

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[info]alias_sqbr
2008-01-14 11:03 am UTC (link)
Nice! *adds to my convention page noone but me reads*

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[info]callistra
2008-01-15 11:17 am UTC (link)
Hee hee hee Femmeconne gets a mention! I get a kick out of it every time *grin*
November the mini writer con is ... um... nanowrimo retreat.
:-)

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[info]mynxii
2008-01-15 11:22 am UTC (link)
I've re-changed the spelling of it now too for you in the actual document.

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[info]alias_sqbr
2008-01-16 04:30 am UTC (link)
I'm actually going to try to come along this year, so the entry should get a bit padded out too :)

The mini writer con I was talking about when I wrote it (in..2005 maybe? 2006?) wasn't for NanoWriMo, it was a literary thing. But I think it was a once off. If the NanoWriMo thing is regular and open-invite I might add it, otherwise I should probably remove that section.

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[info]callistra
2008-01-16 04:47 am UTC (link)
Excellent! I think you will be a wonderful addition! *grin*

Was it run be Elaine? Slashcon? Writercon? There's a few... maybe ask Elaine which ones she runs regularly and would like exposure?

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[info]alias_sqbr
2008-01-16 05:04 am UTC (link)
Heh. I'm not sure my homepage plus the odd propaganda-y email to the unisfa list counts as exposure, but you're right she would be the one to ask :) I might do a call on my flist to see if they know any I've missed, that covers most of the subgroups of local fandom.

(Reply to this) (Parent)


[info]strangedave
2008-01-15 08:49 am UTC (link)
The genres stuff is still mostly bad, for all the reasons I said last time.

The acronyms list needs FFANZ and NAFF added to the list. Having it in alphabetical order would be good.

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[info]mynxii
2008-01-15 10:35 am UTC (link)
i think i still have your notes on the genres from last time - i'll dig it up.

I'll add those two things. Alphebetising, I'll get there, but I'm not so fussed on it :)

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[info]mynxii
2008-01-15 11:31 am UTC (link)
tell me again what Fanz stands for?

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[info]strangedave
2008-01-15 10:12 am UTC (link)
Specific complaints about genre stuff.

Sci-Fi - this term is considered uncomplimentary for the most part when applied to written SF, generally used to refer to media SF focussed on visuals. See the Wikipedia entry on SF for details/confirmation. It certainly doesn't mean what you describe here, which is almost meaningless anyway as its three very different writers, one of them who died decades before the term was ever used. I think this entry is pretty much completely wrong.

Vampire Fiction - this isn't a genre, its a subject. Might as well group together day of the Triffids, Little Shop of Horrors, and the Dr Who adventure Seeds of Death and call it carnivorous plant fiction. Paranormal Romance, which has a strong tendency to feature vampires, is a recognised current genre (and isn't in your list)

Space Opera - the description is not terribly accurate (the original derogatory use of space opera was more about its cliched plotting than its scientific plausibility), but also very out od date - Space Opera is both no longer a derogatory term (see Jonathons collection 'The New Space Opera', or the Hartwell "Space Opera Renaissance' collections for enthusiastic books about the genre), and is certainly no longer considered to be necessarily implying anything about technological plausibility - Alastair Reynolds very Hard SF is also considered Space Opera now, for example. Its about scale and style. The current entry is worse than useless, its misleading, because its giving a dodgy explanation of a 1970s definition for a term that is used in a very different way in the modern day, and is going to lead to horrible confusion (ie if I have a panel on space opera featuring Ken McLeod and Sean Williams (both of whom write what we today call Space Opera), and Jonathon who has edited a collection of Space Opera, and someone looks up your definition and thinks that they are all talking about writing dodgy sf-as-fantasy novels, they are going to be horribly confused, and the guests possibly insulted.

There are only a few of these entries on genre, and about half of them are really bad. Most of the time you would be better off just giving a link to wikipedia. I'd seriously consider dropping the whole idea of putting entries on genre in the list, or making it a separate project.

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[info]mynxii
2008-01-15 10:39 am UTC (link)
I'm thinking through what you're saying. I don't necessarily disagree, I'm just thinking about it, and then I also wish to still have things be not insiderish, and not overly pedantic in the way the information is given which is cliquey. I'll think it through, and give it serious consideration.

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[info]strangedave
2008-01-15 10:45 am UTC (link)
Pedantic is one thing. Correct is another. Your definition of what 'space opera' is, for example, is completely different to what the people who will be talking about space opera publicly at the con (having published books of it) will be using -- giving someone a confusing out of date explanation is literally worse than giving them no explanation at all.

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[info]mynxii
2008-01-15 10:51 am UTC (link)
that i agree with. I'll look into it.

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[info]mynxii
2008-01-15 10:58 am UTC (link)
as in, correct good.

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[info]mynxii
2008-01-15 12:50 pm UTC (link)
I've asked serveral people to go over this too so that I can get a comprehensive view on what I need to look at, and where i need more information - not that I don't trust you to know what you're talking about, but I want to get a broader idea.

I imagine that there will be a lot of change with this section between now and getting it ready for the con.

I don't want to drop the section, it IS one of the confusing things, it drove me nuts for ages, still does at times.

Feel free to offer me suggested replacement text... some of this I've written, or paraphrased from other's comments, some of it was written by others and I've used it with their permission as a community contribution recognition thing.

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)


[info]strangedave
2008-01-15 01:27 pm UTC (link)
I'm only suggesting it might be OK to drop it in the sense that I don't think maintaining it separately as part of this project is the best way to achieve the goal or the best use of our limited resources. Basically, the Swancon stuff is often specific to swancon or at least reflects our specific interests, so it should be maintained separately for swancon, but the genre stuff isn't (in fact, the more the definitions agree with the broader community and don't encourage weird regional variations the better), so maintaining it separately is probably a wasted effort.

Wikipedia entries, for example, generally already have been gone over by many people, so where you can just point to their entries that might be a better idea than maintaining a separate list for swancon -
eg http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Science_fiction#Subgenres,
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Science_fiction_genre
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fantasy_subgenres

and then there are specific entries like
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paranormal_romance or
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Space_opera
And if you feel their entries are lacking, you can always edit theirs, which would mean the effort would be useful to the whole world.

And if you must write your own, going to the appropriate wikipedia entry and summarising it is a much better idea than just asking your friends list, or even the swancon community - everything at wikipedia has already been edited many times (over 500 for their space opera article), so they are already likely to have dealt with easy confusing things. I mean, I could write my own, and they would be better than what is there in most cases, but the wikipedia ones are better still and already done.


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[info]mynxii
2008-01-15 01:34 pm UTC (link)
I mostly agree with what you're saying, the only thing that occurs to me is that the internet and wikipedia is largely unavailable during a con, which doesn't actually make it particularly helpful. Other references to the web are for example only and not to provide the informtation itself.

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[info]babalon_93
2008-01-15 09:09 pm UTC (link)
Okay, can I just step in here and make a request?

1)I agree with Mynxii here that brief genre descriptions (perhaps with a disclaimer that they are often in dispute and a suggestion to consult wikipedia if interested) would be useful to newbies. This *is* something people get very confused about, and also hung up on.

2) A link to wikipedia won't do it because the document is designed to be useful as a hard copy - printing out the wikipedia entries and having a copy on hand could be useful for the *really* interested, and settling (or encouraging) disputes etc, but not for general use or mass prnting.

3)I agree with strangedave - the definitions do need to be accurate, or at least inline with current thinking.

So, my request is this:

Strangedave, could you please summarise the relevant wikipedia entries into a few concise entries in plain language that the average first year uni student could understand? (maybe after you have settled in to your new home :) )

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)


[info]mynxii
2008-01-16 12:39 am UTC (link)
I like this idea, I'm happy to try and summarise one of the documents too, although I'm sure I wouldn't be as good at it as strangedave or others.

(Reply to this) (Parent)


[info]strangedave
2008-01-16 08:57 am UTC (link)
I'd be willing to summarise wikipedia entries (or other uncontroversial sources) into plain language.
I'm not really willing to enter into an editorial process where I have to defend such summaries, though.

I also think that:
- separating it into a separate document from the swancon one is a good idea. It could then be used for other cons, or fandom in general.
- putting both documents in a wiki (like, say, the one at http://wiki.sf.org.au) would be the best way to organise them, rather than a manual editorial process.

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)


[info]mynxii
2008-01-16 01:50 pm UTC (link)
Actually that doesn't work for the entire basis of the document.

I think you would do a really great job of summarising the wiki entries, but the basis of the document is community contribution - I feel that it would need to come under that same provision for seeing what people think as I have done with the rest of it.

The document as it stands is easily adaptable to cons in general, I have a separate natcon version. (the relevant 2 para's will be lifted and imported under the heading 'natcon' for this year's faq document).

I am happy for it to be uploaded as a resource to various wiki's but I don't think that the list should be dropped from this document as my original points still stand.

It IS confusing and irritating to people, by ignoring it and taking it out I feel like I would be leaving an elephant in the room and telling people not to look at it. Having said that I also agree with you that the entries need to be correct.

I am sure that the process for achieving what we're both talking about isn't as difficult as it feels right now, but that said I stand by the fact that the genre section should stay in the document, and that it should still be reviewed by people in general who take the opportunity.

It's always been put forward as an opinionative volunteer fan based document, that is evolving and growing, I've never stated that it's at a final or finished state, just that I am readying it as much as possible for use at the con - it's a use document, they work best as being constantly subject to review.

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)


[info]strangedave
2008-01-17 04:07 am UTC (link)
I don't have any problem with a community contributed document -- its clearly what I'm arguing for when I say it should be wikified -- but if that process starts with having to justify why a source like wikipedia is more correct than what some random person on your flist came up with off the cuff, only to be more or less ignored as my complaints were last year, its hard to work up the necessary enthusiasm for a biggish contribution to the project. I don't mind arguing to justify my own opinions, but having to argue just to establish basic starting line quality based on an external source is something else, and while I think you can run your project how you like, I may not want to volunteer. If asked to summarise wikipedia definitions I would do it, if asked to do so and then argue why it's more correct than some poor quality stuff already there that I've already mostly criticised twice now, my time is more valuable.

IMO the quality of the genre stuff is overall poor enough as to be a possibly little less useful than nothing at all at this point. For example, based on the current program genre definitions they would need to know to understand the program information are either quite wrong, or missing. The process you are using now is not creating a quality document for the genre parts -- certainly, all the stuff I said last year got ignored, so its hard to see why I should want to sign up to be involved to make all the same arguments yet again. I'm suggestion changing that -- and I'm suggesting changing that its not just community contributed, but community edited. Consider why you want to maintain rigid editorial control, given that it increases the time you have to devote to the project, and makes any positive contribution by others dependent on you putting in additional effort and vetting their contributions.

And as far as separating the documents - I really fail to see why having having two separate documents one after the other would be significantly less useful than having one document with two quite different sorts of information mixed in together. Yes, I know its a document to print out to give to newbies -- I don't think they would be overly confused by being given two shorter, more focussed, documents run together instead. I imagine they'd get all the same information on probably the same size bit of paper, just organised differently. Why is that so problematic?

I think at the moment, you want it to be a community contributed document, but you aren't yet willing to give up any editorial control to the community (as you would be by wikifying it). You want it to evolve and grow, but if you want that you have to be willing to prune it back when necessary (if something is allowed to evolve and grow, you sometimes need to do some weeding) and challenge your own initial design choices, and to let it evolve and grow in a way you haven't foreseen. You want it to be subject to review, but want to be able to overrule that review if you don't like what it says, and keep it under your personal control. That is a natural and common instinct, and a perfectly reasonable choice. But it's not working for me.

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[info]mynxii
2008-01-17 04:26 am UTC (link)
I should just remind you that I got the stuff you said about the genre section last year too late to actually amend the document. It's why I'm paying particular attention to it now.

I'm sorry I misunderstood what you were saying with the contribution side of things - with your clarification I see exactly what you mean, and more, agree with you, your time is more valuable than that, and believe me I do not wish to waste it.

I'm happy for the information to be wikified - but what this document is trying to do is be a hard copy useful document, so my concentration is still on that rather than the wiki side of things as there are plenty of wiki enthusiasts who would do a better job than I would.

I've been looking at the document for the past couple of hours. I spent hours looking at it yesterday, and since you brought up your points. Most of which I agree with.

I only wish to retain control of the hard copy based document on the basis that I know that I will continue to be willing to produce it and make it available for each successive Swancon for the next couple of years at the very least - I am comfortable with my commitment to do it, and am only unwilling to trust that others will actually continue to do it, if they take it on and it is handed around without someone actually tending it specifically.

All that said, upon looking at the thing for hours and re-reading it, re-reading your comments, and mine and others, I think that I've been persuaded about taking it out, or at least, taking most of it out. I am looking at a way in which to give a simple overview on genre itself without actually touching on the various genres save to say that there are many of them, that there is continual discussion and dispute surrounding them, and additionally that there are excellent wikipedia entries that talk about them (referencing the links you mentioned).

I'm thinking that this way, I don't have to worry about the document becoming more unweildy, I don't have to worry about it being incorrect - which upset me last year despite anything to the contrary, though overall I was still happy with it as a document.

It would be interesting as a side project for someone to take up, if they were interested, however having said that, I have come to agree with you that it doesn't need to be part of this, not and be 'too hard'. Which i also wish to avoid.

I really appreciate the time you've taken with this, I appreciate the reasoning you've given, and the detail in which you've given it. I appreciate that you have a real problem with it as it stands, and after a hell of a lot of consideration and groping towards 'enlightenment' if you like, I not only see why, but I agree with you, and more than that, have further reasons stemming from the direction I started in that contribute to that conversion of opinion.

I'm not as experienced as you, I've not 'seen all this before' etc, I'm neither as well educated nor as well read as you at this point, and doubt I'll ever get there. I understand that it has been frustrating for you to watch me do this, listen to what I'm saying and still have me come out with things that don't satisfy the problems that you have with the document and it's information. I appreciate the time and attention and information you've given greatly on this level alone, on top of everything I've mentioned previously.

All I can really say is, thank you for persisting, and please continue to bear with me in times like this where I am slow to appreciate the breadth of what you're saying and it's implication. Even if I disagree with something you've said whether it be temporary or unwavering, I don't actually discount what you've said or your experience. I promise you I value it highly.

(Reply to this) (Parent)


[info]strangedave
2008-01-15 01:45 pm UTC (link)
Oh, also - the vampire fiction entry is not only confused in intent, but also quite wrong - vampire literature predates Dracula by a long time, over a century, and I wouldn't describe Count Dracula as 'succubus like', really.

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)


[info]mynxii
2008-01-15 01:53 pm UTC (link)
Noted with the rest.

I'm not sure what I'm going to do, some of my reasoning still stands - despite all you say.

I am open to suggestions that will work for people -at- the con - there has to be something that does what i see as needful, but also satisfies what you're saying (at least mostly).

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